Music Services: add Apple Music?
Answered
Hi,
Just thought, let's drop the question again.
Does Bluesound expect (short term) to add Apple Music as a "Music Service" in the Node 2i?
NOT via Airplay2, but as a Music Service in the Node 2i.
Thanks!
Danny
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That is correct at the present time. There is no 'passthrough audio' mode on the AppleTV. I just confirmed this myself with a couple of receivers and a dedicated HDMI>SPDIF splitter.
This video goes into great depth about Apple Music Hi-Res. The short of it is that it is currently essentially not possible to realize the full benefit without using a Mac or PC connected via USB to a DAC and manually setting the output to match the source on Apple Music, for the app lacks an exclusive mode.
Although I am a purist, I will say that the AppleTV workaround I've implemented sounds better than AirPlay or Sonos and importantly keeps playback on the AppleTV itself and not the iPhone or iPad.
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Hi Craig, I don’t have a DAC that would give me the playback information, only a Helm Bolt portable one for my iPad but there isn’t a way to use it with a Chromecast Audio. I haven’t been able to find any details in the diagnostic part of the BluOS app and from checking an earlier post it appears you can only get playback information within the local library. I tried the link you gave me but it only provided information about printers! Sorry but I am a bit stuck on this one now. One of the known issues with the Chromecast is that the playback information badge within the music service app disappears. I did contact Deezer about it when I used their Hi Fi service and they assured me that I was definitely getting the full CD experience. Based on that I can only trust that it allows 24/96 kHz. It definitely sounds much better than with Airplay to my ears 😊
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Hi Craig, I have just discovered an article on the Darko Audio website where John Darko mentions the Chromecast Audio for high res although he isn’t a fan as it doesn’t allow gapless playback! Happy days it seem to be OK!
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Do you have any update on applemusic,?
My system consist of a NAD MDC BluOS 2 module (not a 2i)
where are you working on?
can you inform me/us.
ill hope to hear from the support team.
gr Robert Jan.
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Yes, it would be helpful to get an update.
It's hard to believe that such a mainstream music streaming service, one that has gone to the trouble of offering lossless and hi-res music, would be so limited and require folks to go through all the steps outlined by Craig and Nigel to get the benefits of the product.
Tony, are the current Bluesound products "future proof" at all, in the sense that if I buy one now it will be able to deliver the full Apple Music streaming service should it become available in the future. I think that means playing hi-res Apple music by streaming it directly from the Internet and not through Airplay. Thank you.
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Tony, are the current Bluesound products "future proof"
Never say never but I will say we make every effort to do so. Note that the original Bluesond NODE N100 released in December of 2012 supports products at the time that had yet been invented such as;
- Spotify Connect
- Alexa Skills
- Actions on Google (Voice)
- ROON
- Over 20 other Music Services, we had yet to partner with
We have no plans at this time to stop supporting the N100.
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It's been 6 months since this thread was last commented on.
Can I ask if there has been any movement on the integration of Apple Music outside Airplay? Or should we give up ever expecting this to happen.
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Excellent question. I was just thinking about this and would love to hear some encouraging news.
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I would switch to Apple Music immediately, if you're in the eco system it's a no brainer and they provide the quality I want, but I'm not able to utilize it on my HiFi system since BluOS doesn't support it.
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On my side I'm thinking about to switch back to Sonos. I regret that I did switch from Sonos to BlueOS some years ago...
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It's "only" 3 years ago, this thread started...
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Thanks all - we also look forward to Apple offering direct integration with systems such as BluOS. Please see; https://support1.bluesound.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/360037270313/comments/1500001189981
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This list of companies that do have direct Apple Music integration continues to grow. We can add Audi to the list this morning.
Two weeks ago, we saw Roku do the same.
At this juncture it seems that more partners are being added, but at a slow an seemingly one-off pace.
My 'hack' to use an HDMI splitter and the Optical in on my Node 2i with an AppleTV works pretty well, though the quality is limited to 48/24. It sounds significantly better than the Sonos Apple Music integration. It was a bit clunky to get this setup going from the Bluesound app interface every time I wanted to use it, so I ended up using Bluesound's excellent REST control API to build a script in HomeAssistant that gets things set straight with a single button press. The primary problem was that Optical inputs into Nodes weren't 'global' within the system, so I had to make sure to select the Node 2i that has the optical input as the master every time. The recently announced Hub will solve that problem.
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Add Waze to the list now (sort of, it looks like some app-to-app integration). Apple clearly has a path to integrating Apple Music into 3rd party apps now. They may have their own priorities for who they are willing to work with. It would be nice to have Bluesound acknowledge that Apple is supporting such integration, and they are pursuing it. Or blink twice to let us know they are already on it and can’t say anything because they are under NDA. I’m preparing to continue building out a Blu-based system, but without Apple Music integration I’m on hold. The Airplay 2 setup is a pain for me, but simply beyond the technical capability of the rest of the family and most guests. And I’ve already been down the Tidal road; Apple Music is not going anywhere for a while in our house.
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I think that now the integration with Apple Music is really necessary. I bought a node some months ago and I was really disappointed when I discovered that Apple service was not integrated (as Sonos does) but only usable with AirPlay… i opened a qobuz account, waiting a solution from bluesound but it seems we are still far from it..
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I have evolved my Apple Music solution from what I have posted here previously, now that I have a Bluesound Hub.
I have a headless AppleTV hooked up to a HDMI/Optical audio splitter, with the optical audio output going into the optical audio input of the Hub. I have setup an automation in Home Assistant that fires whenever I AirPlay from my iPhone to the "Bluesound" AppleTV. The automation groups 3 BluOS zones and sets the input to the AppleTV connected to the Hub, using BluOS REST API. The AppleTV acts as an Apple Music Hub, so in effect the iPhone just becomes a controller for the audio whose source is actually the AppleTV. This solution supports Apple Lossless up to 48/24, since that is the highest level of audio that the ATV will output. It is also 'wife proof', since all that someone has to do is AirPlay from their phone to the dedicated Bluesound ATV.
This is by no means ideal, but it is quite possibly the closest thing one could possibly achieve for Lossless Apple Music through BluOS at the present time.
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@Tony W. - I recently discovered the HiFi Rose 250 streaming device...and besides the sexy screen (which I could live without) the thing that has my attention is they support Apple Music natively. As others have cited above the list of partners working in the Apple EcoSystem is growing. Any updates? I'd like to save the $$ and put it towards speakers.
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The HiFi Rose doesn't support Apple Music natively. There's nothing to that effect on either their website or any of the reviews I've seen, plus there's this response from the company to a question on their own forum about Apple Music:
"Apple Music is difficult to in-app as Apple does not yet support in-app libraries. It seems like that because Apple supports Airplay. Also, it is unlikely that Apple’s policy will change easily. It’s hard to tell for sure what will happen. However, as many users wish, we will proceed with technical review as much as possible."
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They just added support:
“ Many Hi-Fi Rose users have requested to support Apple Music. Apple also released an SDK to support Apple Music in 2021, so we decided that supporting Apple Music is possible and decided to add it.”
But reading this comment from their support does shed some light on the challenges. That said, BlueSound/Core should have a lot more muscle in working with Apple.
https://community.roseaudio.kr/t/information-about-apple-music-service/28921 -
Yes, shop it was in said a firmware download in the last couple of weeks that brought it to life. It was the apple music icon clear as day in their display. May not be perfect but it is progress. Would like to see same here, would be huge.
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Based on the article and video below from Audio Advice, it would appear that HiFi Rose streamers are built on a custom version of Android. Since Apple makes a version of Apple Music App for Android then amount of effort to port the App by HiFi Rose engineers would be non-trivial but not overly difficult. This differs from BluOS where the BluOS engineers would need to be given API's by Apple similar to Spotify Connect and Tidal Connect to get a similar capability. However qualify of the streamed music on the HiFi Rose Streamer will be limited by the capability of the Apple Music App running on their custom Android.
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I assume sonos does not run on custom android and they managed it....
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Tony, should we be petitioning Bluesound or Apple, or both, to give us what we want? On the other hand, if that's just never going to happen, it would be helpful to be told that. Thanks.
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With regard to Sonos I believe that early on Apple gave Sonos 'private API access' so they could offer the service. This was years ago when Apple Music was new and Sonos was the only game in town. I work in high tech and one company giving another company 'private API access' under NDA is not unusual. However, when it comes to 'private API's' what Apple gives they can also take away. What we need is a public API similar to what Tidal did with Tidal Connect so that all companies can benefit. If Apple chooses to exit the smart speaker market, as they already have at the high-end with the withdrawal of the original Home Pod. then I suspect they will open up this API. Look to how they made Apple TV+ App available everywhere and Apple Music on Android phones as examples.
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The apple music app is also on playstation 5 consoles and LG oled tvs too, this includes music videos too!
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Apple aren't going to take away the API from Sonos - it makes no commercial sense to do so, and I've heard the same argument for years but it's still there. Sonos is a much bigger player than BlueSound - for all the constant handwringing and berating of Tony going on here, BluOS isn't going to get Apple natively, it just isn't.
So, time to decide if Apple Music is a big enough deal to bypass BlueSound's products - for me it isn't, as I play my own hi res audio from my NAS.
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Apple announced an API at WWDC. You can read about it here: https://developer.apple.com/musickit/
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MusicKit is a SDK (Software Development Kit) for building apps on iPhones, Android Phones and Apple TV that interface to to the Music App on the device. This is not what is required for BlueSound to include Apple Music on BluOS.
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I been waiting for years for this and/or Spotify Hifi to happen. Funny thing is that I don't really know why. Currently playing all my music using Tidal. Tidal Connect with my Node 2i hifi system and with my Sonos One speakers. With my Iphone (or Macbook sometimes) I either use Tidal with a Dragonfly Cobalt DAC and 3,5 cable connected to decent headphones or to the cars 3,5 mm input and Bluetooth speakers when I go to the gym.
Will an Apple Music integration or Spotify Hifi release make my music world a better place? Easier to use? Don't care about sharing playlist etc.0 -
Is there any update on when Apple Music might be available natively on the Node 2i?
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