Music Services: add Apple Music?
Answered
Hi,
Just thought, let's drop the question again.
Does Bluesound expect (short term) to add Apple Music as a "Music Service" in the Node 2i?
NOT via Airplay2, but as a Music Service in the Node 2i.
Thanks!
Danny
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Has anyone yet figured out the right sequence to find ALAC content on Apple Music and to stream to BluOS devices? I see that music with Dolby Atmos is marked as Lossless but have not been able to find any stereo / lossless music yet.
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According to a tech guy at Naim, Apple is sending a 256k AAC file even when the Apple Music interface says it's lossless. Hopefully that's just teething pains?
https://community.naimaudio.com/t/apple-music-hifi-tier-incoming/16445/437
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I'm pretty sure MusicKit is just for IOS apps, it's been around for five years or so
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The video explaining the new API features is dated 2021. One hopes this bodes well for BluOS and AppleMusic. Incentives for developers include a commission for subscriptions initiated through their app.
This is entirely under Apple's control so best to lobby them to allow BluOS to have AppleMusic as a service.
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Like the others in this thread, I'm also waiting for a log-in to Apple Music on my node2i for listening to Hi-Res, which Airplay2 in its current state doesn´t support at all. Perhaps an Airplay3 is coming soon.....?
But everything could be solved right away, if you were able to stream directly to the Node with the music from Apple.
I just don´t get, that Bluesound is waiting for an API for this, because it works for others, but not knowing how they've solved it. But they have.
In my car, I have the possibility to log-in to both Tidal AND Apple Music, and then stream via 4G/5G, and it works perfectly.
Come on Bluesound, what´s the problem? Is the licensing to high or what?
Don't think so; with many modern cars and soundbars nowadays having built-in accounts.....
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Sonos is doing it, why can't you?
Airplay 2 will only work with 24-bit/48kHz but Apple's lossless music can be up to 24-bit/192kHz.
I'm on the verge of rapidly expanding music throughout the home I'm building. Your direct support for Apple Music will be required to be placed throughout the rest of my home.
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Would be really good with Apple Music as a service since I don’t even have airplay in my NAD T777. Don’t even know if it’s possible to buy a module and it’s very expensive if there is one.
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Tom Toft
"i just don´t get, that Bluesound is waiting for an API"
I posted above a link and in case that someone is reading the content, he or she will find out that the 2021 API is available, of course just in case that can read.
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@ zeroID
Precisely - and fingers crossed ;-)
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This is just getting silly. Apple's Music service is a paid-for, subscription service, why wouldn't they want as many devices as possible to be able to stream it? I already use it on my Sonos speakers, but with Apple introducing lossless across its catalogue it's a no-brainer to want to use my superior sound Bluesound Node 2i to stream it.
Apple themselves say "You can also listen on streaming platforms, popular smart TVs, smart speakers, Android and Windows devices, and more" so why is Bluesound not pushing like hell to be included, rather than being left behind? This isn't a niche service - it's Apple, and it makes Bluesound look outdated.
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"so why is Bluesound not pushing like hell to be included, rather than being left behind?"
Who says we are not? Thanks for your continued patience and enthusiasm.
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Well, Tony, because any time anyone asks about it they get a curt answer about it being Apple's technology and a dismissive retort about it being the same for everyone so just use Airplay. If you were pushing for it, why do we not see that? Why do you not make that public (which, by the way, your snarky "Who says we are not" doesn't actually answer). As Bluesound customers it's not unreasonable to ask if the products we spend hundreds of pounds on are actually going to be as compatible as say, a Sonos One at a quarter the price.
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Currently many in the Hi-Fi Audio Industry are limited by Apple only providing AirPlay at this time, not just Bluesound. Direct Apple Music Integration is simply not available (the above, quoted MusicKit is simply not a solution for the third-party hardware environment). As an existing Apple Partner, once one is available to us, we will be happy to bring it to you.
Thanks for your patience and understanding.
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Thanks. Seems like right now would be the moment for a push to get that integration, with Apple heavily marketing its Hi-Res Audio streaming of its Apple Music subscription service. The fact that the Node 2i can actually process the highest 192kHz has to be a great opportunity, and I'm sure would make it the go-to option for anyone interested in lossless audio. If there's anything we can do as Bluesound customers, and Apple Music subscribers, then let us know.
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For what it's worth, that's exactly what would make me sign up to Apple Music - currently using Tidal but would happily switch to Apple if supported properly (lack of proper integration also stopped me using Amazon HD)
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Richard Thomas and others, this comment thread got really interesting. I think this comment is the one that the Bluesound support crew want to point out but can't 👉 https://support1.bluesound.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/360037270313/comments/1500000966562
Sonos an Spotify seem to have Apple locked down in some contract that gives them premium access. This would explain why Sonos can offer Apple Music as a service and why you can control your wifi speakers globally and from homescreen in iOS with the Spotify app, but not with TidalMaybe it's a nice little conspiracy theory, but it's the best reason I've read here why Sonos and Spotify can get more access to Apple's API's than other hardware and software companies.
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Sebastiaan - I have been following this discussion and feel for the posters. I am currently considering getting the Topping D70. My advice to Bluesound is that you include a USB input to your product. If the Node2i had this, I would be sorted, not ideal but better than nothing, hence now I am looking at Topping. Second - I will advise you consider a way to connect the phone to your products similar to Dts Play-fi (for Windows). Play-fi connects the laptop to my AVR, then anything I play on the laptop goes to AVR - no APIs. I say this because everyone, every forum has this very question -except the culprits - Apple. You go to Roon forum, Audirvana forum, Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer every hardware manufacturer - members are asking "Where is Apple Music in your product". So Apple is not resisting pressure just from Bluesound - The whole industry is asking for this and they are not budging. I think this will take a class action to argue uncompetitive behaviour - short of that - nothing will work. What Apple will do instead, they will figure out why people prefer Bluesound and they will just build a competing product and sell that to you.
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S - where to start.
1. The Bluesound Node 2i DOES have a USB input.
2. Talk of a "class action" is just daft. Apple are not under any obligation to provide seamless integration, and there's no uncompetitive behaviour shown - it's just that others (Sonos) have done a better job at getting the API locked down and integrated into their system.
3. Apple already has its own smart speaker in the HomePod, so they're not looking at building a competing model, they already have.
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Sebastiaan - talk of conspiracy theories makes my toes curl. There's no conspiracy, just different companies managing to get things integrated into their systems at different times and in different ways, and with different contracts. Apple aren't stupid - they know that their Music subscription service is better served by being on as many devices as possible - the problem lies with the third party manufacturers and partners making sure that they too get the App set up.
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Richard - I have a Node 2i - I know what I am talking about - the folks here from Bluesound know what I am talking about.
Homepod does not support hi-res audio. But, I am sure Apple will start making one that does soon so they can rather sell that to you instead of you buying Bluesound. And they will make sure to do that while other manufactures are still unable to access their hi-res service. If that doesn't look like uncompetitive behaviour - then I am indeed daft.
Last, this is not necessarily about other companies doing better than others. It is more about one company being lucky to sign a deal so early in the streaming days, then the market shifting and no longer allowing those deals anymore. You cannot blame other people for Apple's refusal to let them in their platform.
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S - I also own a Node 2i, and I can confirm it does indeed have a USB input. Just check the back panel, it's right below the LAN port.
See What HiFi and Apple for lossless on the Homepods:
WHF: "Apple has revealed on its new lossless audio support page is that "Support for lossless is coming in a future software update"."
Apple: "HomePod and HomePod mini currently use AAC to ensure excellent audio quality. Support for lossless is coming in a future software update."
Sonos also supports hi-res audio (to a maximum 24/48) So yes, but with love, you are, indeed, daft.
This isn't about bashing Apple - it's about getting the companies who want us to invest in their products (or more of their products in my case) to be getting Apple Music integrated properly.
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Chief - I assumed you will read my statement in context.
1. Homepods will (with future firmware) support lossless - not hi-res like the Bluesound products. For Hi-res - Apple will have to offer new product - a firmware will not do.
2. USB in the Node 2i is for storage media only. We are discussing streaming Apple Music. The current Node 2i USB cannot connect to a phone or a laptop, it can only connect to a storage device (hard drive, which I have connected to mine by the way). The Topping on the other hand, can connect to your phone via USB and play your Apple hi-res all the way to 192Khz sampling rates. Off course if you have an iPhone this will not work either because the iPhone will not allow you to send any signal above 48Khz to the external DAC via the lightning connector. But a Macbook will get you there, a Windows laptop will get you there.
3. Apple TV and Sonos are all limited to 48Khz and that is what they call hi-res. It is much better than current, but if the file you are playing is 192Khz, then it gets converted to a lower sample rate. Some of us would prefer the system to play exactly what has been fed to it, no down-conversions. The Bluesound Node 2i does not need to down-convert 192Khz, but the absence of the USB interface leaves no method to interface it with Apple Music.
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Sorry I need to be specific - The Bluesound Node 2i can interact via Airplay and deliver lossless music already. But for hi-res music, with the absence of an API, the USB interface is the only way and that is currently missing. When I say the USB missing I don't mean there is no USB port. I mean the USB port that is there is not designed to do what we are discussing.
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S - just picking up on one thing (& going a little off topic):
Off course if you have an iPhone this will not work either because the iPhone will not allow you to send any signal above 48Khz to the external DAC via the lightning connector.
I don't believe that is entirely accurate - I use a Dragonfly DAC with an iPhone, and the iPhone does output to the maximum 96 kHz that the DAC supports when playing the appropriate files.
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S - I wasn't going to jump back in, cos, y'know, life, but when you make incorrect assumptions they need to be addressed.
Unless you work for Apple or have technical information that has not been released by Apple, you can't claim that "Apple will have to offer new product - a firmware will not do." Apple have stated categorically that hi-res audio will be supported on their Homepod devices via a software update - meaning the capability is there even if it is not currently active. In the same way that Sonos used to be limited to 16/44 and was updated - via a software update called S2 - to play 24/48.
I do not use the USB to connect a hard drive - as it's not designed for a constantly changing library of music, and I instead use my NAS drive over the hardwired network to playback my hi-res files. If you want to say "the USB is not able to be used as a way to interface with Apple Music" then you should say that, not that Bluesound needs to include a USB, which is misleading.
Moreover, the whole idea is to have Apple Music natively accessible on Bluesound devices - not to have an additional dongle or ugly workaround to try to get Music onto the Bluesound app. Such workarounds are not acceptable when a simple API could be used to allow Apple Music to just be there, as it is on Sonos, and as it is with Qobuz already on the Node 2i.
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Pad - Rock - my bad - You are absolutely correct.
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Richard - I rest my case. Regards
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S - phew. Regards
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@ Richard Thomas
I would just like to acknoledge your recent postings in this thread, which suddenly came "alive" again.
I absolutely agree with everything, you´ve stated, and I´am still hoping for a speedy solution - no matter the company solving it ;-)
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