Music Services: add Apple Music?
Answered
Hi,
Just thought, let's drop the question again.
Does Bluesound expect (short term) to add Apple Music as a "Music Service" in the Node 2i?
NOT via Airplay2, but as a Music Service in the Node 2i.
Thanks!
Danny
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Thanks. Seems like right now would be the moment for a push to get that integration, with Apple heavily marketing its Hi-Res Audio streaming of its Apple Music subscription service. The fact that the Node 2i can actually process the highest 192kHz has to be a great opportunity, and I'm sure would make it the go-to option for anyone interested in lossless audio. If there's anything we can do as Bluesound customers, and Apple Music subscribers, then let us know.
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S - I wasn't going to jump back in, cos, y'know, life, but when you make incorrect assumptions they need to be addressed.
Unless you work for Apple or have technical information that has not been released by Apple, you can't claim that "Apple will have to offer new product - a firmware will not do." Apple have stated categorically that hi-res audio will be supported on their Homepod devices via a software update - meaning the capability is there even if it is not currently active. In the same way that Sonos used to be limited to 16/44 and was updated - via a software update called S2 - to play 24/48.
I do not use the USB to connect a hard drive - as it's not designed for a constantly changing library of music, and I instead use my NAS drive over the hardwired network to playback my hi-res files. If you want to say "the USB is not able to be used as a way to interface with Apple Music" then you should say that, not that Bluesound needs to include a USB, which is misleading.
Moreover, the whole idea is to have Apple Music natively accessible on Bluesound devices - not to have an additional dongle or ugly workaround to try to get Music onto the Bluesound app. Such workarounds are not acceptable when a simple API could be used to allow Apple Music to just be there, as it is on Sonos, and as it is with Qobuz already on the Node 2i.
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@ Richard Thomas
I would just like to acknoledge your recent postings in this thread, which suddenly came "alive" again.
I absolutely agree with everything, you´ve stated, and I´am still hoping for a speedy solution - no matter the company solving it ;-)
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Stephen - this is a current limitation of Apple that many AirPlay endpoint Speakers are facing right now.
Venkat - you will have to check with Apple about downloading to your local MacBook but yes you can create a Local Library. Here's how; https://support.bluos.net/hc/en-us/articles/360000197008
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I totally agree with Richard Thomas.
When the missing "BE" was discovered and added, the Tony W. post gave full meaning again.
This section or thread is about the missing Apple Music as an integrated service, and we are some, who calmly but persistently pushes both Bluesound AND Apple to get the best streaming quality possible - without ugly and/or expensive hardware attachments.
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"Whats is doing Bluesound is much, much cheaper which will have a long time effect, pissed off customers wont buy their products.
And the login here with Cross Site Tracking Prevention enabled is still not possible.
Additional incomes Bluesound?"
Civility and calmness cost nothing, Node.
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In that case you are using the DAC in your MacBook, some may not prefer that. You should consider changing your MIDI settings to 24/96.
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Venkat, Airplay is capable of transmitting CD quality signal. But when you stream using Apple music, it looks like it converts lossless to 256AAC. Apple should have a fix for this (it was not fixed last month, but then I cancelled my subscription so maybe now there has been an update, I wouldn't know). The best is to get a USB DAC and connect your headphone jack to the DAC.
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APPLE MUSIC SUPPORT — BlueSound vs. Sonos
Hi thereSome years ago I changed from Sonos to BlueSound with quite a big investment. Currently I‘m using Qobuz music service with my BlueSound devices, but I would like to switch to Apple Music, to simplify the usability (please don’t start a debate about this decision). ;-)
So I‘m quite in the same situation as the guy in this post: https://support1.bluesound.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/4404870600855-Why-does-Sonos-Support-Apple-Music-but-BlueSound-does-not-
Maybe I did miss it, but I didn‘t find an answer to the simple question, „why Sonos could implement native Apple Music support and BlueSound can‘t“ (as I understand currently) and „when BlueSound does support Apple Music natively“.
AirPlay or a Mac for streaming is no solution for me.
Do I really need to exchange all my BlueSound devices (module for NAD M12, several Powernodes, PulsFlex ..) and move to Sonos again or will there be a proper integration of Apple Music services within the next 6 month?
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Soundy, I was the original poster of the question of why Sonos has Apple Music and Bluesound does not and Bluesound support totally beat around the bush on providing an answer and then closed the thread!
I will tell you what I did to get around the puzzling lack of streaming service support from Bluesound. I got a Sonos connect and connected the optical out to the input of one my Node 2i devices. For all of the missing services, in my case Apple Music and LivePhish (literally whitelabeled version of Nugs.net), I use Sonos. For Tidal, Roon and wife AirPlay, I use Bluesound. It is confusing with the multiple apps but it ultimately works quite well.
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I think the simplest way round this is to not use Apple Lossless, and instead buy physical media or high res audio downloads and stream them from a NAS drive on the network - which is exactly what I do. If you're desperate to use a streaming service, pick from one of those natively supported by BlueSound, and let's all get on with our lives.
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I have updated my Apple Music frankenstein system this morning. I’m using a headless AppleTV with an HDMI audio splitter to get an SPDIF output into an NAD 580V2. It appears that AppleTV will output Apple Lossless at 24bit/48kHz. I can also ‘control’ my headless AppleTV from the music app on my phone in a different way than AirPlay. This method allows me to manage the playlist from the Music app on my iPhone but DOES NOT take over any system audio in the same manner as AirPlay if the target is an AppleTV for whatever reason. This means I can continue to do things on my phone that invoke audio but the audio doesn't play throughout all selected BluOS zones. I also looked at my network traffic and confirmed that the AppleTV is the 'host' of the stream. I think this is as good as it gets for now.
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That is correct at the present time. There is no 'passthrough audio' mode on the AppleTV. I just confirmed this myself with a couple of receivers and a dedicated HDMI>SPDIF splitter.
This video goes into great depth about Apple Music Hi-Res. The short of it is that it is currently essentially not possible to realize the full benefit without using a Mac or PC connected via USB to a DAC and manually setting the output to match the source on Apple Music, for the app lacks an exclusive mode.
Although I am a purist, I will say that the AppleTV workaround I've implemented sounds better than AirPlay or Sonos and importantly keeps playback on the AppleTV itself and not the iPhone or iPad.
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It's "only" 3 years ago, this thread started...
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I have evolved my Apple Music solution from what I have posted here previously, now that I have a Bluesound Hub.
I have a headless AppleTV hooked up to a HDMI/Optical audio splitter, with the optical audio output going into the optical audio input of the Hub. I have setup an automation in Home Assistant that fires whenever I AirPlay from my iPhone to the "Bluesound" AppleTV. The automation groups 3 BluOS zones and sets the input to the AppleTV connected to the Hub, using BluOS REST API. The AppleTV acts as an Apple Music Hub, so in effect the iPhone just becomes a controller for the audio whose source is actually the AppleTV. This solution supports Apple Lossless up to 48/24, since that is the highest level of audio that the ATV will output. It is also 'wife proof', since all that someone has to do is AirPlay from their phone to the dedicated Bluesound ATV.
This is by no means ideal, but it is quite possibly the closest thing one could possibly achieve for Lossless Apple Music through BluOS at the present time.
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@Tony W. - I recently discovered the HiFi Rose 250 streaming device...and besides the sexy screen (which I could live without) the thing that has my attention is they support Apple Music natively. As others have cited above the list of partners working in the Apple EcoSystem is growing. Any updates? I'd like to save the $$ and put it towards speakers.
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They just added support:
“ Many Hi-Fi Rose users have requested to support Apple Music. Apple also released an SDK to support Apple Music in 2021, so we decided that supporting Apple Music is possible and decided to add it.”
But reading this comment from their support does shed some light on the challenges. That said, BlueSound/Core should have a lot more muscle in working with Apple.
https://community.roseaudio.kr/t/information-about-apple-music-service/28921 -
Yes, shop it was in said a firmware download in the last couple of weeks that brought it to life. It was the apple music icon clear as day in their display. May not be perfect but it is progress. Would like to see same here, would be huge.
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Based on the article and video below from Audio Advice, it would appear that HiFi Rose streamers are built on a custom version of Android. Since Apple makes a version of Apple Music App for Android then amount of effort to port the App by HiFi Rose engineers would be non-trivial but not overly difficult. This differs from BluOS where the BluOS engineers would need to be given API's by Apple similar to Spotify Connect and Tidal Connect to get a similar capability. However qualify of the streamed music on the HiFi Rose Streamer will be limited by the capability of the Apple Music App running on their custom Android.
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MusicKit is a SDK (Software Development Kit) for building apps on iPhones, Android Phones and Apple TV that interface to to the Music App on the device. This is not what is required for BlueSound to include Apple Music on BluOS.
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@Alex H. That topic has been discussed not only here but also in a lot of other forums on the Internet where people don‘t understand why it is not going to happen? So the information might be not that clear. You can tell that by the amount of new questions from new and also long time Bluesound users concerning this topic. It must be tiring for the folks here at Bluesound to answer the same question every couple of months again and again.
Maybe I didn‘t look very carefully in this forum but I never saw a statement like: „No Apple Music Hi-Res Lossless streaming due to Apple‘s licensing policy on other devices.“
Don’t get me wrong, I really love my Bluesound streamers and I will keep on using them. I will now move away from Apple Music and using Qobuz exclusively. Thanks for the open discussion.
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Richard, this is an oddity or perhaps a feature (by converting the analogue to digital) of the analogue input of Arcam amp / in built DAC, as by the very nature of an analogue signal it has no bitrate / depth attached to it and therefore it’s “quality” cannot be reported.
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Only 4+ years and counting 👎
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Richard's comment above is right. Please guys, when can we reasonably expect a true integration with Apple Music? Is there any real expectation of integration within the short term?
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Tom - and that's not including the fact that this was a re-opened thread on Apple native integration!
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A really unbelievable behaviour. First and last bluesound experience for me. In the only way is AirPlay, a 100€ streamer is enough.
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Tony, MusicKit on the Web allows for content playback. Let me cite: "Apple Music content can play directly in the browser. With MusicKit on the Web, users can stream songs, music videos, and radio from Apple Music on your website using MusicKit Web Components or a player you’ve customized using JavaScript."
Go, BlueSound, go!1 -
On top, a choice between an AirPlay 1 or AiPlay 2 mode on the BluSound hardware could deliver at least lossless OTA if HiRes is not possible.
As a side note, just learned yesterday that apparently there are at least two other streamers, Eversolo DMP-A6 and FiiO R7, that can natively output Apple Music HiRes. So clearly others can do it. I would hate to waste money by selling my Bluesound gear at a loss.1 -
The Eversolo and FiiO both run Android, which I think has been discussed above - you can run Apple Music on Android.
I think at this point it's clear that if BlueSound or BluOS could run Apple Music natively, they would. Apple seems pretty clear on what they consider competitive with their own devices and what is not, and they are acting accordingly. So I'm shifting my pleading to urge BlueSound/BluOS to be the best possible Airplay 2 device, make it as seamless as possible to use Apple Music over Airplay 2, and above all, make the Airplay interaction rock-solid.
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I agree - I think we need to drop the whole "Why won't you support Apple Music ..." and start pestering Apple to allow Bluesound TO support their music streaming service. C'mom folks - don't you think BS would have done it by now if it was possible? I'm a big Apple music listener, and quite frankly I'm more frustrated with Apple over this than anybody else.
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